MN 52
The Man from
Aṭṭhakanāgara
Aṭṭhakanāgara
Sutta
Dhamma Sukha
Meditation Center
A Dhamma talk
by Bhante Vimalaramsi
30-Aug-07
BV = Bhante
Vimalaramsi
BJ =
Bhante Jotikabhivamsa
BV: Ok –
MN:
1.
thus have I heard. On one
occasion the Venerable Ānanda was living at Beluvagamaka near Vesāli.
BV: Too bad
they don’t have American names, isn’t it? You know, Chicago, San Diego.
MN:
2. Now on that occasion the householder Dasama of Aṭṭhakanāgara had arrived
at Pāṭaliputta for some business or other. Then he went to a certain bhikkhu
in Kukkuṭa's Park, and after paying homage to him, he sat down at one side
and asked him: "Where does the venerable Ānanda live now, venerable sir? I
wish to see the venerable Ānanda."
"The
venerable Ānanda is living at Beluvagamaka near Vesāli, householder."
3. When the
householder Dasama had completed his business at Pāṭaliputta, he went to the
venerable Ānanda at Beluvagamaka near Vesāli. After paying homage to him, he
sat down at one side and asked him:
"Venerable
Ānanda, has any one thing been proclaimed by the Blessed One who knows and
sees, accomplished and fully enlightened, wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute, his unliberated mind comes to be liberated,
his undestroyed taints come to be destroyed, and he attai ns the supreme
security from bondage that he had not attained before?"
"Yes,
householder, one such thing has been proclaimed by the Blessed One."
"What is that
one thing, venerable Ānanda?"
4. "Here,
householder, quite secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from
unwholesome states, a bhikkhu enters upon and abides in the first jhāna,
which is accompanied by applied and sustained thought, with rapture and
pleasure born of seclusion. He considers this and understands it thus: 'This
first jhāna is conditioned and volitionally produced. But whatever is
conditioned and volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to cessation.'
If he is steady in that, he attains the destruction of the taints.
BV: Now this
is telling you, that even if you go into just the first jhāna, you can get
to the destruction of the taints. You don’t have to go through all of the
jhānas. It’s considerably easier when you do, but, you don’t have to. It
depends on, how you see things.
Look at that.
Both of them have their head on the pillow. Isn’t that something.
So, what I
was telling you before, that if you attain jhāna, you have the potential, in
this lifetime, to attain nibbāna. It’s just, means that you have to be,
wanting that to happen, by pointing your mind in that direction, and then
working towards that, seeing how the process of everything works, without
getting involved in the content, of it. Seeing the process, how does this
arise? Why does it arise? Who cares? How does it arise? That’s the key. And
when you see that as part of a process, now you’re seeing it as an
impersonal process. And the more you see it as impersonal, the more freedom
there is, the easier it is to let go of, the attachments to this or that.
MN:
But if he does not attain the destruction of the taints because of that
desire for the Dhamma, that delight in the Dhamma, then with the destruction
of the five lower fetters he becomes one due to reappear spontaneously [in
the Pure Abodes.]
BV: Now we’re
talking about, if you didn’t get to be an arahat after you got out of the
first jhāna, than at least you’ll get to be an anāgāmī.
MN:
and there attain final Nibbāna without ever returning from that world.
BV: And
that’s one of the advantages of being an anāgāmī. You are reborn in a brahma
loca, and there’s, there’s six, brahma locas that you can reborn in, and
this is where the idea of the Pure Abodes come from. But there’s some real
misunderstanding because they, the Pureland Mahāyāna sect, they really get
into their heavenly realm and it’s more beautiful that anything you’ve ever
heard of before, and you’re destined to get to nibbāna after you’ve
experienced this. But, this is for people that are anāgāmīs. It’s for that
realm of being an anāgāmī. It is not for just anybody for repeating a word,
over and over Amitābha, Amitābha, Amitābha. For one thing, the Buddha never
taught mantras. That’s Hindu. And when I put that in my book, The
Mindfulness of Breathing book, you have no idea how angry that made some
people that had been practicing Tibetan Buddhism, because they like their
mantras.
Anyway, an
anāgāmī, see you have, sotāpanna. If you’re a sotāpanna, at the most, you
will have seven more lifetimes before you get off of the wheel. You become,
a sakadāgāmī, this is called a once returner. That means that you’ll come
back to the human realm, one more time, before you become, fully
enlightened. The anāgāmī is called the no returner, because they’re never
going to be reborn in the human realm again. Now they might live for a real
long time, in one of the brahma locas, and they do their work there, and
become an arahat, and then when the karma of that life is burned out, then
when they die, there is no more becoming. They’re off of the wheel.
MN:
"This is one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One who knows and sees,
accomplished and fully enlightened, wherein if a bhikkhu abides diligent,
ardent, and resolute, his unliberated mind comes to be liberated, his
undestroyed taints come to be destroyed, and he attains the supreme security
from bondage that he had not attained before.
5. "Again,
with the stilling of applied and sustained thought, a bhikkhu enters and
abides in the second jhāna...He considers this and understands it thus:
'This second jhāna is conditioned and volitionally produced. But whatever is
conditioned and volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to cessation.'
If he is steady in that, he attains the destruction of the taints.
BV: (To Ven.
UJ) Now I have a question for you in the text itself. Because it’s bringing
up, just about anicca. It’s just bringing up about impermanence. Does it say
anything about the impersonal nature of this process, in the sutta?
BJ: Doesn’t
show.
BV: It
doesn’t show. Ok, thank you.
Now what
they’re doing, is ah, the commentary is real big on talking about
impermanence, suffering, and not-self, and how you have to see that, in
everything. But the actual practice, is seeing Dependent Origination, and
how that works. If you just look at impermanence, suffering, and not-self,
you don’t go very deep, with your understanding of how this process works.
It still stays pretty much on the surface. So, it’s important to see that
everything is impermanent, and it is a form of suffering, and it is a
impersonal process. It’s important to see that, but not near as important as
it is to see how the process actually does work and the four noble truths
intertwined in it.
Repeats (If
he is steady in that, he attains the destruction of the taints.) Now,
basically, what they’re saying is:
Repeats (But
whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to
cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains the destruction of the
taints.)
I have real
problem with that statement. Because it’s pushing you to look at
impermanence, rather than going deeper into the process, and seeing the
arising and passing away of all phenomena, at each one of the links, and
it’s not really mentioned here. So, and they don’t bring up the word
“wisdom” here, so I have some, some issue. Because we have to be careful how
we, ah, how we develop our understanding. We have to be very careful with
that. If we make up our mind that it’s just- our understanding is really
good, but it’s at, impermanence and suffering, then you never even consider
looking any deeper than that. You want to develop that mind that, that does
penetrate deeper, that does look more closely at how the process works.
Ok-
MN:
But if he does not attain the destruction of the taints...without ever
returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.
6. "Again,
with the fading away as well of rapture, a bhikkhu...enters upon and abides
in the third jhāna...He considers this and understands it thus: 'This third
jhāna is conditioned and volitionally produced. But whatever is conditioned
and volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is
steady in that, he attains the destruction of the taints. But if he does not
attain the destruction of the taints...without ever returning from that
world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.
7. "Again,
with the abandoning of pleasure and pain...a bhikkhu enters upon and abides
in the fourth jhāna...He considers this and understands it thus: This fourth
jhāna is conditioned and volitionally produced. But whatever is conditioned
and volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to cessation.' {If he is
steady in that, he attains the destruction of the taints.}
BV: Boy, I’m
really having problems with this sutta right now. It’s like it’s pointing
away from the experience of nibbāna, rather than to the experience of
nibbāna. Because it’s not, it’s, it’s more involved with what is
volitionally produced and it being impermanent, than seeing how the
impersonal process is actually working. I guess, if you want to look at it
this way: If he is steady in that, if he is steady in seeing the
impermanence, and letting things be, and seeing that process, then attaining
the cessation, you could say it that way, and that’s how he would attain the
destruction of the taints. I don’t see any other way that that can happen.
MN:
But if he does not attain the destruction of the taints...without ever
returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.
8. "Again, a
bhikkhu abides pervading one quarter with a mind imbued with
loving-kindness, likewise the second, likewise the third, likewise the
fourth; so above, below, around, and everywhere, and to all as to himself,
he abides pervading the all-encompassing world with a mind imbued with
loving-kindness, abundant, exalted, immeasurable, without hostility and
without ill will. He considers this and understands it thus: 'This
deliverance of mind through loving-kindness is conditioned and volitionally
produced. But whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced is
impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains the
destruction of the taints. But if he does not attain the destruction of the
taints...without ever returning from that world.
BV: Now the
interesting thing about these statements, is, that the only way, that you
can become an anāgāmī, or an arahat, is through the mental development of
meditation. But it’s not just the mental development of the meditation, it’s
the mental development of the meditation and your understanding. And during
the time of the Buddha, there was a lot of people that did all kinds of
weird meditation, and they would come to the Buddha, and he would straighten
out their thinking, and because they had done so much meditation, they would
start relaxing more and more because they hadn’t seen the tension and
tightness, and just while he was talking, they would become arahats, because
they had the meditation already. They didn’t have the understanding that
needs to be there. That’s the insight and the samatha, they need to be
hooked together.
Yeah?
S: ~
BV: To become
a sotāpana, a sakadāgāmī, you can do the meditation, or not, depending on
your understanding. You can become a sotāpana, if your understanding is good
enough, about the process of Dependent Origination. That’s what happened to
Sāriputta. He ran across the arahat, Assaji. And he’d been practicing
meditation with somebody else. And the arahat was eating his meal, and
Sāriputta got him some water and waited patiently until he got done, and
washed and cleaned up, then he said: “Who do you, practice with, and what do
they teach?” Now Assaji, he just simply said: “I practice with the Buddha,
and everything that arises,”… no, that wasn’t it. Bhante, what is the verse
for Sāriputta, that, when he heard, he became a sotāpana?
BJ: ~
BV: Yeah, it
is Dependent Origination, but he gave him the first part, and it was just
two lines. And just his hearing that, his understanding was such, that he
became a sotāpana. And then he heard the rest of the verse, and he said:
“Thank you very much, I’m going to your teacher now.” And he went to
Moggallāna because they had made an agreement that whoever attained any
super human state first, they would go and tell the other one. And then when
he went to Moggallāna, he gave Moggallāna the whole verse, and Moggallāna
became a sotāpanna, just from hearing it. But they had developed their
meditation before. Their understanding was quite brilliant.
S: ~
BV: They
didn’t realize it, but the Buddha recognized it, when they started coming.
When Moggallāna saw Sāriputta, Sāriputta was very vibrant, and radiant, and
very much in the present moment, and he noticed those kind of thing, because
they’d been traveling around together a lot, you know . So, to become a
sakadāgāmī or a sotāpanna, you can, do that, with a minimum amount of,
meditation, but it’s always easier if there is some meditation. Now there’s
different kinds of sotāpanna. There’s one kind that’s called a Dhamma
sotāpanna, there’s one that’s called a faith sotāpanna. Now they have the
experience of seeing nibbāna, but they have not attained the fruition yet.
And they will have a tendency to want to sit down and do meditation, and
they start seeing how Dependent Origination is in everything, and how it
works. For some, they think of it only as a very narrow, very fine thing,
and you come along and say: “Well don’t only look at it that way, it’s in
everything and it can be very big too.” Or if they’re looking at everything
very big, you coma along and say: “Well it’s very fine and you can look at
that way too.” And that can be enough to trigger somebody’s mind so they do
have the experience.
Anyway.
The
interesting part about this, right here, is that it’s talking about
practicing Loving-Kindness, and then attaining nibbāna. And it’s not just
any nibbāna, it’s either having all of the taints destroyed, or becoming an
anāgāmī. So, this belief that Loving-Kindness only leads you to the jhāna,
right here, says not. That’s not the way it works. And they’ve been trying
to figure out the one-pointed jhāna, on how to make that work, for a
millennium. Long periods of time, they’ve been working with that. And that’s
why there aren’t so many arahats around today. Because they got off of the
path. They just stopped following what the Buddha said, especially about,
the relaxing step. Because that changes your entire meditation. There’s no
getting around that. And you see how important the relaxing step is now,
when you start seeing that little twinkles and stuff, and you relax right
then, it doesn’t even come up into any kind of internal verbalization. So
you’re really starting to purify your mind with much more clarity and depth,
absolutely.
MN:
"This too is one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu
abides diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from
bondage that he had not attained before.
9. "Again, a
bhikkhu abides pervading one quarter with a mind imbued with
compassion...without ill will. He considers this and understands it thus:
This deliverance of mind through compassion is conditioned and volitionally
produced. But whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced is
impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains the
destruction of the taints. But if he does not attain the destruction of the
taints...without ever returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.
10. "Again, a
bhikkhu abides pervading one quarter with a mind imbued with altruistic
joy...without ill will. He considers this and understands it thus: This
deliverance of mind through altruistic joy is conditioned and volitionally
produced. But whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced is
impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains the
destruction of the taints. {But if he does not attain the destruction of the
taints...without ever returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.}
BV: I have
problems with: “If he is steady in that,”. I have real problems with that,
because that doesn’t tell you what he’s steady in. And you naturally start
assuming that you’re looking at the impermanence, rather than the process of
Dependent Origination, and, impermanence.
Anyway -
MN:
11. "Again, a bhikkhu abides pervading one quarter with a mind imbued with
equanimity...without ill will. He considers this and understands it thus:
This deliverance of mind through equanimity is conditioned and volitionally
produced. {But whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced is
impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains the
destruction of the taints. But if he does not attain the destruction of the
taints...without ever returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolute he attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.}
BV: So.
MN:
12. "Again, with the complete surmounting of perceptions of form, with the
disappearance of perceptions of sensory impact, with non-attention to
perceptions of diversity, aware that 'space is infinite.' a bhikkhu enters
upon and abides in the base of infinite space. He considers this and
understands it thus: This attainment of the base of infinite space is
conditioned and volitionally produced. But whatever is conditioned and
volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is steady
in that, he attains the destruction of the taints. But if he does not attain
the destruction of the taints...without ever returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One wherein if a bhikkhu abides
diligent, ardent, and resolutehe attains the supreme security from bondage
that he had not attained before.
13. "Again,
by completely surmounting the base of infinite space, aware that
'consciousness is infinite,' a bhikkhu enters upon and abides in the base of
infinite consciousness. He considers this and understands it thus: "This
attainment of the base of infinite consciousness is conditioned and
volitionally produced. But whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced
is impermanent, subject to cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains
the destruction of the taints. But if he does not attain the destruction of
the taints...without ever returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One
wherein if a bhikkhu abides diligent, ardent, and resolute
he
attains the supreme security from bondage that he had not attained before.
14. "Again,
by completely surmounting the base of infinite consciousness, aware that
'there is nothing,' a bhikkhu enters upon and abides in the base of
nothingness. He considers this and understands it thus: 'This attainment of
the base of nothingness is conditioned and volitionally produced. But
whatever is conditioned and volitionally produced is impermanent, subject to
cessation.' If he is steady in that, he attains the destruction of the
taints. But if he does not attain the destruction of the taints because of
that desire for the Dhamma, that delight in the Dhamma, then with the
destruction of the five lower fetters he becomes one due to reappear
spontaneously [in the Pure Abodes] and there attain final Nibbāna without
ever returning from that world.
"This too is
one thing proclaimed by the Blessed One who knows and sees, accomplished and
fully enlightened, wherein if a bhikkhu abides diligent, ardent, and
resolute, his unliberated mind comes to be liberated, his undestroyed taints
come to be destroyed, and he attains the supreme security from bondage that
he had not attained before."
15. When
venerable Ānanda had spoken, the householder Dasama of Aṭṭhakanāgara said to
him: "Venerable Ānanda, just as if a man seeking one entrance to a hidden
treasure came all at once upon eleven entrances to a hidden treasure, so
too, while I was seeking one door to the Deathless, I have come all at once
to hear of eleven doors to the Deathless. Just as if a man had a house with
eleven doors and when that house caught on fire, he could flee to safety by
any one of these eleven doors, so I can flee to safety by any one of these
eleven doors to the Deathless. Venerable sir, these sectarians will even
seek a teacher's fee for their teachers; why shouldn't I make an offering to
the venerable Ānanda?"
16 Then the
householder Dasama of Aṭṭhakanāgara assembled the Sangha of bhikkhus from
Pāṭaliputta and Vesāli, and with his own hands he served and satisfied them
with various kinds of good food. He presented a pair of cloths to each
bhikkhu, and he presented a triple robe to the venerable Ānanda, and he had
a dwelling worth five hundred built for the venerable Ānanda.
BV: I guess
he got off on Ānanda, hun? (Laughs) Yes?
BJ: ~
BV: Here,
when you hear: “subject to cessation”, it makes you think: “Ah, this is
leading to nibbāna”, that kind of cessation, but, I don’t think that’s… I’m
suspect of this sutta, very much. See, we have to have wisdom in there some
where, but we don’t. And that makes me suspect of this sutta. I hadn’t
thought of it that way before, but it’s really pretty much true. It keeps
your observations more surface. Any time you’re just looking at
impermanence, without seeing that Dependent Origination, it’s way up here,
and we want to be down here some where.
Anyway, any
questions, statements, any thing like that?
Let’s share
some merit then.
May
suffering ones, be suffering free
And the
fear struck, fearless be
May the
grieving shed all grief
And may
all beings find relief.
May all
beings share this merit that we have thus acquired
For the
acquisition of all kinds of happiness.
May
beings inhabiting space and earth
Devas and
nagas of mighty power
Share
this merit of ours.
May they
long protect the Lord Buddha's dispensation.
Sadhu . .
. Sadhu . . . Sadhu .
. .
Sutta
text translation: (C) Bhikkhu Bodhi 1995, 2001. Reprinted from The Middle
Length Discourses of the Buddha: A Translation of the Majjhima Nikaya with
permission of Wisdom Publications, 199 Elm Street, Somerville, MA 02144
U.S.A,
www.wisdompubs.org
Text
last edited: 30-Jan-08
Berlin-1 Apr 09
Bogor Dec 10
Vietnamese